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	<title>Comments on: Fish Training Resumes</title>
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	<link>http://stalecheerios.com/blog/fish-training/fish-training-resumes/</link>
	<description>a serial for positive animal training</description>
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		<title>By: Shaping behaviors in a goldfish using clicker training &#124; Stale Cheerios</title>
		<link>http://stalecheerios.com/blog/fish-training/fish-training-resumes/comment-page-1/#comment-6486</link>
		<dc:creator>Shaping behaviors in a goldfish using clicker training &#124; Stale Cheerios</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Feb 2010 01:13:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stalecheerios.com/blog/?p=1719#comment-6486</guid>
		<description>[...] do a wide range of behaviors. I wrote about the beginnings of my fish clicker training experiences here, including conditioning my marker [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] do a wide range of behaviors. I wrote about the beginnings of my fish clicker training experiences here, including conditioning my marker [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mary Hunter</title>
		<link>http://stalecheerios.com/blog/fish-training/fish-training-resumes/comment-page-1/#comment-6347</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary Hunter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Dec 2009 19:14:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stalecheerios.com/blog/?p=1719#comment-6347</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re right, Ark Lady!

Animal training has been around for ages, but it&#039;s only recently that we&#039;ve begun to describe it in scientific terms. 

One of the biggest advantages of clicker training that I see is that it improves the timing of the trainer and makes the trainer more aware of their actions. Leads to quicker learning and less frustration on the part of the animal! A skilled trainer, though, can often get the behavior they want with or without a clicker. 

As for positive, training, I think positive reinforcement is the fastest and most humane way to get most of the behaviors we want. Novice and intermediate trainers are often not skilled enough to use punishment and negative reinforcement and often jump to these procedures too quickly. 

I think the goal should be positive training, but we should recognize that some animals and some training situations might benefit from carefully applied punishment or negative reinforcement procedures. 
For instance, negative reinforcement can be a great way to shape friendly behavior in fearful or aggressive animals, such as approaching and retreating from a fearful horse and retreating whenever the horse offers calm or friendly behavior. 

Mary</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re right, Ark Lady!</p>
<p>Animal training has been around for ages, but it&#8217;s only recently that we&#8217;ve begun to describe it in scientific terms. </p>
<p>One of the biggest advantages of clicker training that I see is that it improves the timing of the trainer and makes the trainer more aware of their actions. Leads to quicker learning and less frustration on the part of the animal! A skilled trainer, though, can often get the behavior they want with or without a clicker. </p>
<p>As for positive, training, I think positive reinforcement is the fastest and most humane way to get most of the behaviors we want. Novice and intermediate trainers are often not skilled enough to use punishment and negative reinforcement and often jump to these procedures too quickly. </p>
<p>I think the goal should be positive training, but we should recognize that some animals and some training situations might benefit from carefully applied punishment or negative reinforcement procedures.<br />
For instance, negative reinforcement can be a great way to shape friendly behavior in fearful or aggressive animals, such as approaching and retreating from a fearful horse and retreating whenever the horse offers calm or friendly behavior. </p>
<p>Mary</p>
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		<title>By: Mary Hunter</title>
		<link>http://stalecheerios.com/blog/fish-training/fish-training-resumes/comment-page-1/#comment-6346</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary Hunter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Dec 2009 19:03:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stalecheerios.com/blog/?p=1719#comment-6346</guid>
		<description>Good point, Jane!

I think in many instances, a click is much clearer and distinct as a marker signal. However, I do know some people who have been very successful with a verbal marker. 

The key, I think, is that the marker must be easy for the animal to see/hear and be an accurate predictor of food delivery. For some dogs (and horses), I think they totally ignore the click and instead  are attending to the hand reaching for the treat. So, reaching for a treat becomes a visual marker, rather than the click. 

Mary</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good point, Jane!</p>
<p>I think in many instances, a click is much clearer and distinct as a marker signal. However, I do know some people who have been very successful with a verbal marker. </p>
<p>The key, I think, is that the marker must be easy for the animal to see/hear and be an accurate predictor of food delivery. For some dogs (and horses), I think they totally ignore the click and instead  are attending to the hand reaching for the treat. So, reaching for a treat becomes a visual marker, rather than the click. </p>
<p>Mary</p>
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		<title>By: Jane</title>
		<link>http://stalecheerios.com/blog/fish-training/fish-training-resumes/comment-page-1/#comment-6326</link>
		<dc:creator>Jane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Dec 2009 17:31:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stalecheerios.com/blog/?p=1719#comment-6326</guid>
		<description>Very cool to see a goldfish being trained Mary :)  I was interested to see you write that the &quot;spoken word&quot; can be a marker signal when my understanding and experience is that the spoken word doesn&#039;t really work that well as a marker signal because we vary how we say even a simple word like &quot;good&quot; so much.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very cool to see a goldfish being trained Mary <img src='http://stalecheerios.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />   I was interested to see you write that the &#8220;spoken word&#8221; can be a marker signal when my understanding and experience is that the spoken word doesn&#8217;t really work that well as a marker signal because we vary how we say even a simple word like &#8220;good&#8221; so much.</p>
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		<title>By: Tweets that mention Fish Training Resumes &#124; Stale Cheerios -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://stalecheerios.com/blog/fish-training/fish-training-resumes/comment-page-1/#comment-6324</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention Fish Training Resumes &#124; Stale Cheerios -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:52:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stalecheerios.com/blog/?p=1719#comment-6324</guid>
		<description>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by dogspelledfwd, Mary Hunter. Mary Hunter said: Fish Training Resumes http://goo.gl/fb/XqDa [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by dogspelledfwd, Mary Hunter. Mary Hunter said: Fish Training Resumes <a href="http://goo.gl/fb/XqDa">http://goo.gl/fb/XqDa</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ark Lady</title>
		<link>http://stalecheerios.com/blog/fish-training/fish-training-resumes/comment-page-1/#comment-6323</link>
		<dc:creator>Ark Lady</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Dec 2009 15:43:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stalecheerios.com/blog/?p=1719#comment-6323</guid>
		<description>I am glad to see you talk about training as not being species specific. One of the biggest misconceptions I find is that people always want to know how to train &quot;x&quot; (x=a particular species or breed).

If you have the principles of behavior modification--which I would not label as positive training (because both + and - are used in the process beyond the basics) you can train just about anything.

What is new in the current animal training world is not new at all. In fact, I&#039;ve traced it back to the Hagenbeck zoo in the late 1800s when they used food rewards with their captive animals.

However, the scientific world tested and quantified the process which has morphed into &quot;clicker training&quot; aka &quot;positive training.&quot;

I&#039;ll be focusing more on training on my blog in 2010.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am glad to see you talk about training as not being species specific. One of the biggest misconceptions I find is that people always want to know how to train &#8220;x&#8221; (x=a particular species or breed).</p>
<p>If you have the principles of behavior modification&#8211;which I would not label as positive training (because both + and &#8211; are used in the process beyond the basics) you can train just about anything.</p>
<p>What is new in the current animal training world is not new at all. In fact, I&#8217;ve traced it back to the Hagenbeck zoo in the late 1800s when they used food rewards with their captive animals.</p>
<p>However, the scientific world tested and quantified the process which has morphed into &#8220;clicker training&#8221; aka &#8220;positive training.&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll be focusing more on training on my blog in 2010.</p>
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